Arghghgh -- black fly is back!

Thu 6 Aug 2015, 13:35

Yes indeed Alison, its worth bearing in mind the deer park...

Thu 6 Aug 2015, 09:41

It's always a good idea to wear plenty of insect repellent when walking in Cornbury.

Thu 6 Aug 2015, 09:15

Is anyone worried about getting (fly) bitten up on the Cornbury estate during Wilderness? Did anyone get bitten last year? I had a Blandford fly bite a few years ago, (actually while in Blandford) which was terrible, with egg- sized, painful lumps on my legs, making it impossible to walk for some days.

Thu 30 Jul 2015, 18:37

I acquired Avon Skin So Soft for a recent walking trip to Poland. To save paying excess postage I ordered three 150ml sprays, but only really need one, so if anyone is desperate let me know - you are welcome to have them at what I paid for them.

Thu 30 Jul 2015, 15:47

Black fly bites probably explain why I had a terrible itch in both legs for 3 days this week. I am planning to go to the open air jazz concert at Ditchley on Sunday, so I guess I shall have to tuck my trousers into my socks unless anyone has a better idea!?

Sun 26 Jul 2015, 15:30

My poor little boy seems to be very prone to these bites and has had absolutely loads of them. The only thing that has deterred them is the Avon Skin So Soft, which I bought from eBay (DEET didn't help at all). I used Anthisan on the bites and that seemed to help a bit.

Sun 26 Jul 2015, 14:28

So for the first year in about 3, I avoided any blandford fly bites. I put Avon Skin So Soft on my legs below the knee every day. For a bit of extra oomph, I usually added a few drops of citronella as well. I can't say it definitely, definitely was the Skin So Soft, but so glad to have avoided the annual cellulitis and antibiotics I've had every summer, not to mention adding to my collection of fairly nasty darkened circles on my skin that remain behind.

Sun 24 May 2015, 22:30

Thought I'd re activate this from last year, as it has reappeared again, just a few days later... There is lots of information here.

Tue 24 Jun 2014, 16:56 (last edited on Tue 24 Jun 2014, 16:56)

According to the Avon website the nearest rep. is Steph Harris, located 2.1 miles from Charlbury.

Email address is, steph.h.avon@hotmail.co.uk

Tue 24 Jun 2014, 16:12

It seems it is cheaper to buy it in bulk (well, 3 bottles) on Amazon than just buying one bottle. I'd be interested in one. Would it be useful to group together?

Tue 24 Jun 2014, 15:40

..Oh ok, Thank you. I'll have a look as Amazon are very good.

Tue 24 Jun 2014, 15:07

I don't think you need to find an Avon Lady. I've just ordered some from Amazon.

Tue 24 Jun 2014, 12:11 (last edited on Tue 24 Jun 2014, 13:04)

That's very interesting, does anyone know who the local Avon Lady is please?

Tue 24 Jun 2014, 10:49

Alison, you're right. Avon Skin so Soft is great at repelling insects. I use it all the time (otherwise I get bitten everywhere). It's just a regular spray-on skin moisturiser but has this hidden talent of keeping the midges etc away. Can recommend.

Mon 23 Jun 2014, 20:38

Kat - Have you heard about Avon Skin So Soft being used by the British and US Marines as an insect repellent? I haven't tried it myself (although I do plan to). I'm not an Avon Lady and I realise it does sound quite odd, but apparently it really does work.

Mon 23 Jun 2014, 12:13

Just to clarify, I have been bitten by this fly for three summers in a row, always up Ditchley Road where I live, always between my knee and ankle. This last time, I think I was bitten while hanging out laundry. For those of you who merely apply antihistamine cream for a few days after and forget about it, you are indeed lucky. I am having worse and worse reactions to the bites, so that within a few hours, the whole leg is hot, itchy, swollen, and the bite location turns black, about the size of a 5p piece. Even after a course of antibiotics, I only stopped suffering after 4 weeks, and still have red circles and scabby scars 5 weeks later. So, any help on spraying the rivers against the larvae will be very much appreciated from my point of view. In the meantime, I guess a daily dose of bug spray on my lower legs is in order, but I'm not keen on loading my body up with DEET, honestly.

Fri 23 May 2014, 23:26

They obviously like Hixet Wood. They've been visiting me in my garden this week. Very nasty.

Fri 23 May 2014, 13:09

Jon, no thankfully not. I appreciate it might be a best guess on occasion but the more information the better even if it gets filtered out as unreliable by those whose review the data. Patterns however might emerge which may indicate areas to surveys for potential larvae habitats. With all the surveying, assessments and any required treatment costs this won't be a cheap undertaking so focusing in on certain areas might make it a more affordable process for the Council/ EA to undertake.

Fri 23 May 2014, 12:37

I agree, Charlie, but it is difficult to know exactly when and where you are bitten. Have you been bitten yourself?

My experience of four bites is that it is the merest pinprick at the time, and if you are walking through undergrowth, swatting other flies in the garden, or scrabbling about in weeds, you are likely to miss it. There is really nothing more to see or feel for some hours, and the telltale itchy swelling may not really develop for a day. By then you may not know at what point on a 6-mile walk the bite occurred, or whether it was in your garden or outside the Co-op.

I'm still interested to see if anyone has used insect deterrents and whether they have worked.

Fri 23 May 2014, 09:54

It would perhaps be diligent to keep a record of locations and dates of bites to inform any future surveys. If this is deemed to be a Charlbury wide issue then perhaps a website or even a tab on this website could be devoted to logging this information. This can then be used to assess any allocation of funds and the necessity of the environmental risk associated with a survey or any further action it deems necessary.

Thu 22 May 2014, 17:12

I was bitten again yesterday and, given all that I have read here and more besides, I consider it my own stupid fault for not applying Deet to my bare legs before gardening! (Sucking the bite and immediately applying Antihisan has made it less painful than last time, and the swelling and stiffness less pronounced.)

I notice that no one (except me!) has mentioned deterrence. Has anyone reading this used Deet, and has it worked? Difficult to prove, of course: I applied it one day last week and wasn't bitten, but I didn't use it the following day and wasn't bitten either! It is supposed to be 100% effective. I've used it on holidays in other circumstances and it has appeared entirely effective.

Thu 22 May 2014, 16:13

Yes there should be a proper round of consultation which I am am sure there will be and contact with the Agencies mentioned in previous pots.
No there have been no reported fatalities - yet. But any septicaemia which requires intravenous antibiotic is quite serious and could be fatal in infants and the elderly.
I would just not like to see the first fatality happening in Charlbury especially after this discussion

Thu 22 May 2014, 15:46

OK it is reassuring to learn that it is very targetted, and biological rather than chemical. I was wary of getting up local pressure to support a cause of dubious environmental impact but it sounds like there may be some justification, and hopefully as Charlie says there would be a full assessment before any decision was taken. Tony, I would like to see evidence of it being fatal to children before leaping to such alarming conclusions though.

Thu 22 May 2014, 11:23

Tony, (just made the name connection!) I don't think the EA would let you go anywhere near the river without a consent which would have to be the result of an comprehensive impact assessment/ survey.

Are there more bites because its a mild spring so people are clothed differently?
Is…

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Thu 22 May 2014, 10:17

Thanks for the post Charlie and I was not suggesting this was undertaken lightly - we would just be starting a consultation phase. You may like to look at this link to answer some of your concerns www.fish.state.pa.us/pafish/bass_black/smb2006/reebuck.pdf
but nothing will be done until we have all relevant advice. The main point is that bites can have serious complications Some victims have had to spend several days on a drip, being pumped full of antibiotics, in order to see off the infection. I would not be surprised if it could even be fatal in young children.

Wed 21 May 2014, 22:00

There's a really good book to use as a reference for this, Silent Spring by Rachel Carson. Whilst I am really sympathetic to all those affected and no doubt I'll be bitten tomorrow as a result of this mail, I can not believe this is even being considered. Unless a comprehensive study of the impact is undertaken, specific to our river ecosystem who knows what impact this could have. Ok it's a "biological" weapon which was by all accounts successful in one situation but surely we should be talking about undertaking a survey of Blandford Flies rather than calling in an airstrike.

Wed 21 May 2014, 21:26

I spoke to the Town Clerk today and the Agenda for the Council Meeting next week is very busy so I will now raise this at the June Meeting
To answer some points the insecticide Bacillus Thuringiensis Israelensis is not a chemical but a bacterium that infects the Black Fly very specifically. It has been recently used in the US on a very large scale programme and they studied any effects on fish or any other wildlife very closely and concluded it caused no risk
However it would need careful planning with consultation with the appropriate bodies as pointed out earlier. Also it would need financing but this is a serious threat to people in Charlbury so the council will consider this very carefully. Also as several walks are close to the river I will also raise this with the Cotswold AONB as there must be a high risk for the Wardens walks at this time of year.
In the meantime insect repellents such as DEET are pretty effective if you can stand the smell!
I will keep you all posted.

Wed 21 May 2014, 07:22

That's dreadful Kate. I see now why it matters! I had wondered about the scouring of the river bed. Each time we try and solve one problem we create another! Haven't riparian landowners been under government pressure to clear banks and keep the rivers flowing?

Tue 20 May 2014, 22:06

Jon I think it may depend how much you react to them: I was bitten on the wrist last year and swelled up from elbow to fingertips, couldn't bend my wrist, and had a fever for about a week... I think the reason they sprayed the Cherwell was because of the potential risk to cattle, which presumably must also be true of the Evenlode. The control in that case was a nematode which attacked the larvae, so did not affect any other species. I think that the 2007 flood scoured the riverbed, and wiped out some of the natural larvae predators including the English crayfish, which is why it has been getting steadily worse over the last few years; maybe this will reverse slowly as the ecosystem re-establishes - let's hope so!

Tue 20 May 2014, 20:51

Spraying kills the larvae, so well before the flies hatch. The larvae are found in flowing streams/rivers, so apraying does not cover a wide area. The bacterium, Bacillus thuringiensis, which is used has been approved for organic farming for decades. Lots more information here: www.bt.ucsd.edu/index.html

I agree that if the only problem with these bites is an itchy swelling, getting a helicopter out seems a bit extreme. From what I read, the bites themselves are not poisonous: problems arise if people scratch and infect the bites. My bites stopped itching after about 5-6 days and by now (8-9 days) the swelling has gone down and I've forgotten all about them. Antihistamine and antiseptic creams took the edge off. But maybe I'm from a generation that just learnt to put up with these things!

Tue 20 May 2014, 19:57

A good point well made Helen. I've been bitten twice by what would sound like black fly though both of these were in my garden on Ticknell Piece almost 2/3 mile from the Evenlode. If they travel this far then that's many miles of riverbank to spray to 'protect' Charlbury and a lot of insecticide.

Tue 20 May 2014, 19:20

Should we really be jumping to solutions involving insecticides for something that is unpleasant but not dangerous? We don't know what other insects and river-life these insecticides may affect.

Tue 20 May 2014, 17:55

I have now been in touch with the Centre for Ecology & Hydrology who did the original control in Blandford.
It seems that it should work but there is quite a bit to consider. However I do think we should pursue this and will raise it with the Council next week.

The reply from the Centre for Ecology & Hydrology was as follows ;
I appreciate the problem with the Blandford fly in your area ?" it is particularly prevalent around Charlbury ?" I have collected quite a few from that area many years ago and know they have been seen at least once by an entomologist rising from the river in black clouds. Fortunately they unlike lots of blackfly species in this country only have one life cycle a year so after May they should dwindle and not be seen until the next year.

Regarding control yes CEH was involved in a biological control strategy in the River Stour in Dorset many years ago. I was told by the ecologist who was involved that it was very successful but was not maintained by the council so I imagine they have returned.

The insecticide used was a bacteria called Bacillus thuringiensis and you can find out about it from an example of a control program in the States looking at the effect on fish www.fish.state.pa.us/pafish/bass_black/smb2006/reebuck.pdf

An insect control management program is a big thing to manage and not something CEH would now undertake I am sure.

You would probably get more information from the Environment Agency on Bt and other insecticides used in river systems.
Best wishes
John Day

Tue 20 May 2014, 15:09

Might be worth investing in an Mosquito Magnet Machine if your garden is prone to these. Midgetech do one which is for all nasty biting insects, they are not cheap but quite effective and have less impact than the alternative.

Tue 20 May 2014, 09:58

That would be fantastic if there were some way of dealing with it locally - I think it's seasonally applied, so that there is a window early in the year of a few weeks when they are at larval stage and the biological control takes them out, so if it could be set up for next spring that would be a huge relief!

Mon 19 May 2014, 22:13

This is a serious problem and the position of the environment agency is in line with the fact that there is no infectious disease being transmitted
However I would agree that we should look at some possibilities for combating this locally
In the original outbreak in the late 1980s, Dorset County Council asked the Institute for Freshwater Ecology (now the Centre for Ecology and Hydrology), then based in Wareham, Dorset, to investigate a means of ameliorating the problem. They suggested using a biological insecticide, Bacillus thuringiensis israelensis (Bti), which was sprayed into the weed beds, resulting in the destruction of 80?"90% of the Blandford fly larvae and a corresponding reduction in the numbers of people bitten.[4] Indeed, it is reported that the number of people bitten has dropped to less than one hundredth of those affected in 1989.
I will try to see if this biological solution is still available and if so recommend that we take some action at the Town council meeting next week

Mon 19 May 2014, 09:22

Oh dear. So some of the little dears are potential high flyers. Other flies bite of course but these seem unmistakable.

Sun 18 May 2014, 23:53

I was bitten on my left leg a week ago. The swelling is almost gone now. We're up on Ticknell Piece--nowhere near the river!

Sun 18 May 2014, 15:30

I was bitten over two weeks ago by my neck/throat, (not used to being bitten)large red swelling with tail 4 "long. Didn't want to bother doctor but Boots very helpful, antihistamine for two weeks. Almost gone but still visible. Very painful and so itchy !!! that was the worst bit for me. So it appears the little "devils" can bite further up than the legs.
Hope this helps someone else.

Sun 18 May 2014, 14:52

Ah, so the Blandford Fly is the culprit. Bitten on Wednesday in Hixet Wood. Apparently the surgery have had a surge of cases during the week. Anthesan doesn't touch this bite - I needed antihistamines and antibiotics. A cold compress gives temporary relief. Nasty bug.

Sun 18 May 2014, 10:33

Loads of advice on the internet -- of course! :) The flies generally stay within 18ins of the ground, so for prevention (rather than trying to soothe after the event) use an insect repellent (DEET in 100% concentration is the most effective -- see en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DEET ) on your legs below the knee, and on your forearms if you are reaching down into wet/riverside places. (I got bitten picking rhubarb by the stream in a friend's garden in Taston!)

I think it's district councils that spray the river banks (or don't), not the government, from what I read.

Sat 17 May 2014, 14:28

I've been using Aloe Vera gel, it's very soothing.

Sat 17 May 2014, 11:27

Thanks. Now I know what bit me the other day on my left ankle and caused it to go puffy and itchy. Easing off now. Would cortisone cream help?

Sat 17 May 2014, 08:48

I've got bitten 2 weeks ago on my right ankle which swelled up massively, but this week I have been bitten 6 times over both legs, not pleasant !!!

Fri 16 May 2014, 19:07

That's hard Kat - I've been bitten a few times and it's really grim! I know when there was a German researcher looking at them about 10 years ago she said that they had sprayed them on the Cherwell because their bite could be fatal to cattle, and I've tried…

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Fri 16 May 2014, 15:16

Third year in a row I've been bitten by the Blandford Fly in my garden, this time on both legs. I'm on antibiotics and still have fever and can hardly walk. I know others are suffering around Charlbury. I understand they've been prevalent again after the Government has stopped spraying river banks to combat them (note to local councilors!) Anyway, just to let you know that if you get a bug bite that swells a lot and really, really itches, then take antihistamines and get to the doctor if it turns red and hard and starts to spread up your leg, as then you have cellulitis and need medicines.