Bell hotel

Tue 17 Aug 2021, 20:15

The quotes refer to the White Horse in Stonesfield, Christine.

I am hoping that the people at the Horse & Radish will clarify the situation.  I will call them if I don’t get a response to my email.  I suspect that, understandably, they are running their pub.  As soon as I can be certain of the situation, rather than add to the speculation, I will let people know.  Meanwhile the Town Council will consider ACV status.

I’m more than happy to go over the wretched history of relationships between the tenanted pub companies (pubcos) and licensees, for anyone interested, in the thankfully free of tie Rose & Crown.  Indeed, a friend has offered to come down and talk about it, from direct first hand experience, if there’s interest.

Tue 17 Aug 2021, 19:20 (last edited on Tue 17 Aug 2021, 19:23)

Gareth -- I'm not understanding. 

Are you talking about the Stonesfield pub, or about the Stonesfield pub when you say that "The most recent update to shareholders stated that ‘The pub is still closed with no word when it will reopen. We have tried to reach out to the new owner to see what the problem is and whether we can help"? 

I think these two sentences and the rest of your post must refer to the Stonesfield pub. What I was asking about was whether anyone on the Town Council has been in touch with the potential managers of The Bell who run the Horse and Radish to find out more about their intentions.

And, yes, I have registered that Greene King still own the freehold (alas). And that the Horse and Radish team and also Greene King know about Street Fair.

What I am struggling to understand is whether anyone on the Town Council has been told that the Horse and Radish team have altogether lost interest. Given the late planning approval date (mid-June) and the well-documented shortage of building materials, lack of progress in remedying the structural defects in the pub building does not necessarily mean that the H&R team aren't still moving forward with their plans for The Bell.

Tue 17 Aug 2021, 18:45 (last edited on Tue 17 Aug 2021, 20:04)

Christine, Brian - Greene King continue to own the freehold.  
The people at The Horse and Radish (as I said in an earlier comment) took on the lease in January.  I have tried to contact them.  They and Greene King are both aware of the Street Fair now.  
The freehold price of The Bell is likely to be well above that of the White House in Bladon or the White Horse in Stonesfield.  It is unfortunate that the community bid in Stonesfield was rejected.  
The most recent update to shareholders of the White Horse community bid stated that ‘The pub is still closed with no word when it will reopen. We have tried to reach out to the new owner to see what the problem is and whether we can help, as have a number of others in the local area including members of both the Parish and County Councils, but to no avail. This is both sad and worrying as there is little sign of work even to prepare the pub for re-opening.  [The new owner]  has indicated that he’s struggling to find a tenant. We have offered to use our communication channels to promote any advertising that he has carried out . The pub does not appear to be specifically listed on the usual tenancy websites, so we are waiting for him to share this information with us.’

Tue 17 Aug 2021, 17:13

Christine, is it the freehold that's become available or is it actually a lease that Greene King (or any more recent freeholder) is offering?

Tue 17 Aug 2021, 11:10

I would be interested to know if anyone on the Town Council has spoken to the potential managers of The Bell who run The Horse and Radish at Minster Lovell, and who might still wish to manage The Bell, even if they have declined to take on the freehold.

The WODC website shows that it was only on June 18 that the final planning permission was approved for the internal changes to The Bell, including remediation for the major structural problems that emerged (including damage by Death Watch Beetle). I can well imagine that they are still in the picture, perhaps even still negotiating with Greene King -- especially since they were reportedly still interested when Hannen talked to them a few weeks ago.

Tue 17 Aug 2021, 09:09

I wonder if the Bull would be interested in taking it on. They seem to be doing well now but their bedrooms aren't as well reviewed as the Bell's were so perhaps they'd benefit from the extra space. If they siphoned off the more traditional "burger/pizza/pub grub" dishes from their menu and kept the prices down they could appeal to a different audience. The other pub that seems to be pulling them in is the Swan at Ascott under Wychwood which I think is owned by Country Creatures. I recognize that those establishments aren't to everyone's taste but they do seem to have good business models

Mon 16 Aug 2021, 19:41

As Tony says, Andy and I campaigned to keep the Bull as a pub when the then owners tried to convert it to housing some years ago. The application for it to be considered as an Asset of Community Value (ACV) will have to be made by the Town Council and I am glad to hear that is in progress. A good example of how this can work is the White Horse in Stonesfield where the village raised a huge amount in privately issued shares ( I bought some myself as I think several people in Charlbury did). In the end a private buyer emerged, as with the Bull, but if Stonesfield can raise the money to save their pub we can do that in Charlbury, I am sure.

Sun 15 Aug 2021, 09:49

Gareth i have no experience of this area but if the council do decide to pursue it I would be happy to provide financial planning support as I did for the beer festival and community centre

Sun 15 Aug 2021, 07:39

Thanks Gareth.

Sat 14 Aug 2021, 17:26

In January I wrote to the Town Council suggesting they needed to consider ACV status.  It is under active consideration again.

I’ve contacted Greene King and, slightly surprisingly, had a reply, so among other things they are aware that the Street Fair is coming up and have promised to catch up with the organisers.

Sat 14 Aug 2021, 12:31

Michele

Liz Leffman took the lead in co ordinating the opposition to the Bull being converted to residential but I suspect she's got enough on her hands with her new role as leader of the council!

Maybe the town council and/or district councillors could take the lead in looking into making the Bell a community asset

I'm sure a lot of people would want to keep the Bell and would be prepared to provide their professional expertise if there was a co ordinated approach

That is what got the Community Centre built when Margie Glasgow led the way

Sat 14 Aug 2021, 07:42

I looked on the Greene King website but the Bell was not listed as one of their establishments available on a managed, leased, or tenanted basis - so no clues as to what their plans are there.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 21:23

Is this an opportunity to fund raise and bring The Bell under community ownership? It's a successful model elsewhere -- is it worth considering? Big step and commitment I know, but it would be just awful to lose The Bell.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 17:55

Steve - just dropped you an email on that front.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 14:39

I have been trying to contact Greene King on behalf of the Charlbury Street Fair, as we use the forecourt for the sound stage and park the two trailers with the gear for the stalls in the car park. I was promised a call back, but as expected, it didn't arrive so I will do some more following up to formalise permission to do this again (we appear to have an alternative for the power).

As to the future of the establishment, we will have to keep our fingers crossed. Without the Bell, then there's only the Bull for hotel accommodation plus whatever is on AirBnB.

I suspect it's going to require somebody with fairly deep pockets to bring the place up to standard as, with any building of that age, it's going to have expensive issues, not to mention keeping the conservation officers happy.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 12:41

What a shame, they must have spent quite a lot of money already on works there. I certainly quoted for curtains and blinds.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 12:30

The freehold remains in the hands of Greene King who submitted a retrospective planning application for Listed Building Consent in the Spring.  It appears the lessees (who have or had the Horse and Radish) went in on a pretext of removing a number of fittings and altering the layout, found serious building defects along the way, and then found they had some attention from Heritage England.

As with most pubcos operating a tied tenancy model - completely inappropriate for somewhere like The Bell of course, and unlikely to get different results in future - Greene King are highly unlikely to provide any additional information to the community.  However, it seems that none of the works now consented are taking place.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 10:37

Thanks Rachael.

Shame.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 10:11

They have pulled out. It still owed by green king

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 10:05

It's been bought by the owners of The Horse and Radish:

https://www.thehorseandradish.com/

I went there for lunch a couple of weeks ago, and spoke with them.  The re-opening has been delayed because of planning permission "problems" and difficulties sourcing building materials with the current supply chain difficulties, but they want to re-open asap.

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 08:56

Don't you mean IF 

Thu 12 Aug 2021, 07:13

Does anyone know when The Bell is going to reopen?