Robert Courts (Debate)

Mon 21 Sep 2020, 14:53

I see that our MP's financier (?!) is back in the news again. I refer to Lubov Chernukhin.
All the sordid details here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54228079

Tue 8 Sep 2020, 17:31

I see that there has been a "non-entity shuffle" in the cabinet:

Someone called Simon Clarke has resigned. And ...

"Luke Hall will replace Mr Clarke, while minister Kelly Tolhurst moves from the Department of Transport to the Local Government Department, with Robert Courts being appointed a minister at Transport."

Scraping the bottom of the barrel ... again ... :-\ 

Wed 26 Aug 2020, 23:17 (last edited on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 23:18)

Yes he did! 

Also worth noting that some cross party MPs are subsequently threatening to sue the government over the lack of an independent enquiry in this matter:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/aug/21/mps-threaten-to-sue-boris-johnson-unless-he-acts-over-russian-meddling-in-uk-polls

 Here is his reply (but he make no mention of donations to his "fighting fund"...):

Dear Matthew,

Thank you for writing…

Long post - click to read full text

Tue 25 Aug 2020, 19:14

Matthew Greenfield said on 28 July that he will be writing to Mr Courts to find out what the government will be doing to counter Russian influence in British public life in the light of the Russian Report by parliament’s intelligence and security committee.

Has Mr Courts replied?

Tue 28 Jul 2020, 13:28

Thank you Christine for bringing this to our intention. I will be writing to Mr Courts to find out what the government will be doing to counter Russian influence in British public life in the light of the Russian Report by parliament’s intelligence and security committee. 

Mon 27 Jul 2020, 16:35 (last edited on Mon 27 Jul 2020, 16:39)

Robert Courts is much in the news today: BBC, Tatler, Witney Gazette. This links to the report on Russian influence on UK political processes, the publication of which Johnson tried to suppress.

Courts (or rather the Witney Conservative Party) received £3,000 from Lubov Chernukhin, a British citizen of Russian origin, who is also the highest-spending female donor in UK political history.  

The donation was registered in February this year, and was described in the register of financial interests for MPs as for ‘my 2019 fighting fund’. It appears that this is by no means the first time that she has donated to the Witney Conservative Party.

An old Daily Mail story provides a very interesting account of her wealth, her history of tax avoidance and also of her husband's past links to Putin: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6990893/Murky-past-ex-Putin-cronys-wife-enjoyed-cosy-dinner-PM-revealed.html

Wed 8 Jul 2020, 16:07 (last edited on Wed 8 Jul 2020, 16:08)

Today's mendaciousness in PM's question time  "a Freeport in Londonderry/Derry is something that can only be achieved by Brexit".

Does Mr. Johnson think we are stupid?   There are currently 80 Freeport's in the EU.  There were 7 Freeport's in the UK between 1984 and 2012 when the UK legislation that established their use wasn't renewed.  I wonder why?   There are 24 free zones in England today geared towards particular industries.  Why are people being taken in by this rubbish?

I have written to Mr Courts asking him to press for an apology to all social care staff.  I don't feel very optimistic.

Tue 7 Jul 2020, 08:52

On 3rd April I emailed my sister to let her know that hospitals were being emptied of ill and untested for Covid 19 elderly people for end of life care into the care home system.  At that time there were no tests and no protective equipment and the care homes were seeded with Covid 19.  My sister emailed back "That would be criminal". 

I know that the residents of Charlbury are sufficiently well informed to know when their Government is trying to re-write history.  So they will recognise Mr. Johnson's attempts to deflect blame by his policy of deny, deny, deny.

I suppose that the NHS staff who insisted that care homes accept these very ill people were just following orders.  I suppose that the Council staff who threatened to take away the Council contracts from care homes if these patients were not taken were just following orders.  

Please accept my overwhelming thanks to all those incredibly brave care home managers and staff who refused to take patient discharges in April and kept their homes safe.  My mother is in one of those homes and for the moment, she remains safer than us.

Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:46 (last edited on Tue 23 Jun 2020, 11:46)

On the other stuff... there's really so much to unpick here Carl, honestly where to start? A mess of untruths, anecdotal evidence and - to borrow your word - complete bollocks 😂

"You can’t seriously blame the government for a death rate caused by the spread of a virus?" - life must be quite simple for you 😂

Heathrow/Frankfurt and Gatwick/Munich airports have almost the exact same figures on international travel, and yet Germany has 8,885 covid deaths compared to the UK's world-beating 42,632. This works out at 10.7 deaths / 100,000 of population vs. 64.1 in the UK. Oh wait, not quite world-beating, we're just behind the fascist in Brazil and Trump's US - wahoo! 

But let's not talk about government's response, can't be to do with that... 

*Newsflash* in from the lefty papers (the Daily Mail and Telegraph): "Up to 3/4 quarters of covid deaths could've been avoided in the UK with an earlier lockdown". Looking forward to the mental gymnastics on this one 😆

Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:15

Carl - saying you know many people 'who took it upon themselves to isolate long before the official order from the headmaster' is all well and good, but unfortunately, is not a realistic option for a lot of people in this country, many of whom have had to work up until lockdown was announced, and many had to continue to work throughout. It is unrealistic to claim that people should've known better, when the government had been ignoring all the warning signs of other European countries already in lockdown, and had maintained that we should not follow suit too early. This led to a quicker spread of the virus, which was a direct result of that ignorance and has in turn led to a longer period of lockdown in the UK.

Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:08 (last edited on Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:13)

Please tell me that your remark about a burning building was a thoughtless analogy, rather than a reference to Grenfell Carl.

Sun 21 Jun 2020, 14:18 (last edited on Sun 21 Jun 2020, 14:20)

Yes, thanks Mathew for such a measured response – and your latest -  something I aspire to if with the occasional (hopefully amusing) little quip.  And spot on.  I’ve said at least twice on here that this (handling of the pandemic) is not so much about party politics – though that inevitably colours the discussion – as about competence, about getting things done.  To that I’d now add integrity, sadly lacking in some cases.  There are several former Conservative ministers who might well have done a better job, but are now side-lined by the Cummings/Johnson cabal.

I’m off too though, at least from these exchanges. Rosemary puts it more bluntly but some of the most recent posts seem to be based on simplistic prejudice, not so much ‘following the science’ or looking at the facts as simply dismissing them out of hand, and on unsupported assumptions about the people expressing a different point of view – so not much point in trying to ‘debate’ any further because there isn’t one.

Sun 21 Jun 2020, 13:33 (last edited on Sun 21 Jun 2020, 13:41)

The front page from that well known “leftie” newspaper the Daily Mail on Friday 19th June read “How many more corona fiascos?”

https://twitter.com/bbchelena/status/1273719856802693120?s=21

The same paper asked “What planet are they on?” on Monday 25th May when Dominic Cummings tested his eyesight during lockdown. It just goes to show that criticism of the current UK government goes beyond political tribalism. 

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 23:00 (last edited on Sat 20 Jun 2020, 23:03)

There are some interesting and valid points (much) earlier on for which I thank you. Since this is now gasping for air in the putrid sewers, I’m out.

Matthew, your contribution just appeared here as I was writing .... thanks for that.

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 22:50 (last edited on Sun 21 Jun 2020, 13:21)

You can't blame a government for the occurrence of a virus but you can certainly blame a government for poor management of a public health crisis. We are an island nation and had an opportunity to stop the spread of the virus earlier with decisive action. It is not bollocks, it is what scientists have said could have saved tens of thousands of lives in the UK. 

You only had to look at what was happening in Italy to know that the same would be happening here without a lockdown and yet there was an unforgivable delay. It does not matter what political persuasion the government is in such a crisis but there was certainly a pitiful lack of leadership in the UK. It is a fact that countries that acted quicker with a coherent strategy have done much better. 

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 21:38 (last edited on Sat 20 Jun 2020, 21:39)

Ah Carl, it's nice to know there's one sane person in this town at least who can separate politics from a natural (or dependent on your wont, Chinese engineered virus; American biological weapon; Russian shiggles) incidence. We should have a drink some time and laugh at these bollocks. 

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 19:09 (last edited on Mon 22 Jun 2020, 12:19)

🙄🙄🙄

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 15:37

Carl, sounds as though you’ve been taking advice from Jacob Rees-Mogg.

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 15:14

You can’t seriously blame the government for a death rate caused by the spread of a virus? And all this “the lockdown should have happened sooner” bollocks (not a swear word, appeared in several windows in Charlbury back in December) is precisely that...bollocks!

I know of many people who took it upon themselves to isolate long before the official order from the headmaster. I get annoyed with all the lefties shouting that the government introduced lockdown too late, the virus was around and people were made aware of the risks. I personally Wouldn’t sit in a burning building and wait for someone to tell me to get out, I would have gone out already.

You also have to factor in that the UK is different from most other countries in that it is essentially an international hub. People travelling to/from the Americas and the Far Easr generally travel through London which involves hotel stays, restaurants, sightseeing etc. So that will be a contributor to the high infection rate in London initially and then elsewhere. Remember the woman that was going to go to a refugee camp in Calais and come back? Glad that didn’t happen... or did it?

I’m bored with myself having to argue this now. It’s just typical Boris Tory bashing because of election win and Brexit.

I’m sure if Corbin was in power now people would be making excuses for him rather than criticising 

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 10:03

The situation in this country is nothing short of  a humanitarian disaster for hundreds and thousands of bereaved relatives and friends of the deceased from Covid-19. We have been led to believe that many of those lives could have been saved. I'd like to repeat, I'm not making this up, and a lot of expert opinion is out there. 

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 09:48 (last edited on Sat 20 Jun 2020, 12:45)

But Mathew, Rosemary - isn't it so reassuring to know that with Cummings, sorry, Johnson in charge we are just ahead of Trump and Bolsonaro??

More seriously, there seems to be general consensus at least on the reasons Labour lost the election along with the Lib Dems’ poor showing.  The report Tony refers to was actually produced by some in the Labour Party for the Labour party.  That to my mind bodes well in that they are at last showing signs of coming to their senses post-Corbyn with a leader who actually looks and sounds like one.

I don’t though see much point in speculating on what might have happened if Labour had won a. because they didn’t and b. there wouldn’t have been time for them to do anything significant before the virus hit us if they had.  The furloughing and bank loan systems – or something like them – would have been necessary whoever was in power.  Sure they may have prevented total collapse of the economy but both have holes and problems – and are temporary measures.  The furloughing scheme is set to close by the end of October and only then might the real impact on jobs and the economy become clear.

Meanwhile the government’s failings are so self-evident even Piers Morgan recognises them as a shambles!

Sat 20 Jun 2020, 09:46

Rome is still burning, guys.

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 23:04

OK, let's just say the UK government are among the worst in the world in dealing with the coronavirus pandemic. At one point it was reported that we had the highest death rate in the world:

https://www.businessinsider.com/uk-has-highest-coronavirus-death-rate-in-the-world-2020-5?r=US&IR=T

I know the UK government doesn't like comparisons to made with other countries. You can see why...

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 22:22

Rosemary: I think you will find Brazil and the USA have the worst records. Let's not hyperbolise. 

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 19:16 (last edited on Fri 19 Jun 2020, 19:17)

Carl. Worst record in the world  of handling, or mis-managing, the Covid-19 pandemic. Blatantly ignoring all the relevant pointers on ‘how to do it’ with our country being behind other countries already locking down, as we started to understand we were getting it here.

Boris.... idiotically blathering on about herd mentality, when we are dealing with a completely unknown killer disease, with unknown behaviour.  Boris ..... idiotically shaking hands knowingly with staff and patients in a Covid-19 ward....need I say more... every day there are incompetencies beyond belief. These have caused thousands of lost lives, unnecessarily. I don’t need to say any more, do I. It’s all out there. I’m not making this up.

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 16:39

Rosemary,

"I agree with you about the dismal antics of the Labour party, but in a way I now want to be thinking beyond the various failings of any of the parties, and be concentrating on the current massive failings of the current government"

Please elaborate on the 'massive failings'?

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 14:52 (last edited on Fri 19 Jun 2020, 14:52)

Plus they didn't have to get the support of 27 other countries which is holding up the EU bond support scheme and causing increasing anger in Italy & Spain

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 14:46

Of course. And the furloughing was only available on the scale it was because the treasury was able to accommodate it. A reason why I have always voted Conservative - they seem to have more economic competence than Labour

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 13:36

Carl, yes, there I think there have been numerous blunders and missed opportunities by all the parties at one time or another. The fact that we have furloughing in place is what we should expect, and not have to feel grateful for. It’s their job to look after the country, we pay them.

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 13:29

Tony, I only offered my response to your question of why did so many working-class northerners desert Labour and Lib Dems, i.e. voted for the Conservatives.

I agree with you about the dismal antics of the Labour party, but in a way I now want to be thinking beyond the various failings of any of the parties, and be concentrating on the current massive failings of the current government, which surely go beyond anything we have experienced in our generation. I’ve heard the expression ‘fiddling while Rome burns’ many times in my life but it it has never seemed so apt as it is now.

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 13:07

I agree Carl. I advise a company that employs over 100 people and because of the furloughing introduction we have not had to make anyone redundant, despite a significant fall in turnover during lock down. Now the business is starting to operate again, many jobs will have been saved due to the swift action by the Chancellor

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 12:54

Rosemary, I think you'll find that most people were terrified at the prospect of a Corbyn government. If he had managed to win the election I'm sure we would be in a much dire situation now as he would have already spent all the money on re-nationalisation of everything. And who were the other alternatives? The Liberal Democrats, who had nothing to offer but stopping Brexit? That really backfired didn't it!

Also, all governments make mistakes and blunders, the difference is that we now live in age where 24 hour media scrutiny and the prevalence of social media exposes every single one of them. Not so many years ago politics was hardly ever in the headlines, now it seems to be constant.

I think the government has done some very good things that the media don't like to publicise - like the various schemes designed to prop up the economy. A lot of the small shops and businesses reopening up now would have gone weeks ago in many cases if these schemes were not introduced. How often do you hear the BBC analysing how many people would be unemployed now if it wasn't for the furlough scheme compared to how many actually are? Never!

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 12:52 (last edited on Fri 19 Jun 2020, 12:53)

Rosemary I have no time for Johnson or Cummings but an excerpt from a report in the FT today shows why they are in power

The report largely blamed the leadership of Mr Corbyn, the ambitious manifesto and the party’s prevarication over Brexit for its devastating defeat The report claimed that Labour entered the election unprepared, with a weak strategy, too many policy announcements and no clear message. At the same time the party was convulsed by a “toxic culture” . One official describing a “hostile and cold” atmosphere at party headquarters. It surveyed 11,000 members and used data from academics and pollsters. The report found that “Stop Jeremy Corbyn” was a major driver of the Tories’ success across all key groups including previous non-voters, given a widespread dislike and concern about the hard left former leader. It estimated that the party lost voters everywhere in the country apart from London, with support haemorrhaging most among working-class communities.

Fri 19 Jun 2020, 09:07

Tony, many, if not most, first-time Conservative voters were taken in by the lies and deceit of the unprincipled Prime Minister and his ghastly puppeteer, Cummings. The Tory government continue to lie and deceive, and are proving themselves daily to be the most incompetent party in the world.

Thu 4 Jun 2020, 13:56

I’m sorry you feel you are victims.  Nobody forced you to vote for inhumane policies.  I’m afraid it’s up to you to sort it out.  Quite a few of us here have been disenfranchised all our lives.  

Wed 3 Jun 2020, 20:26

Richard is quite right. Let's not lose sight of the real victims in all this: conservative voters. 

We may vote for inhumane policies, but that doesn't mean we are not human!

Sat 21 Mar 2020, 12:13

We’re all now facing something far more worrying than our political differences – so this will be my last post on this thread (hooray I hear from 3 of the 6 people reading it!).  Just before I go though – my little rants actually went in various directions but weren’t personal to anyone in Charlbury (beyond our MP), I didn’t call anyone a monster and I make no apology for expressing myself ‘robustly’.  No-one said you have to agree with me. 

Thu 19 Mar 2020, 17:40 (last edited on Thu 19 Mar 2020, 17:53)

Well, if you think there is no choice but to vote for smug ex-public schoolboys because there isn't a viable alternative, do something about it. Anyone can stand for election, here or anywhere else! I apologise if I offended you, Richard, and others that vote Conservative. You are entitled to vote exactly as you wish.

Thu 19 Mar 2020, 15:56

I could add 'some' to the start of my post Charlie - but that seems to imply that you are admitting to being smug!

Tue 17 Mar 2020, 22:12 (last edited on Tue 17 Mar 2020, 22:14)

Particularly when the option was a left wing Marxist government or an undemocratic lib dem party There must have been a reason why so many northern working class people deserted labour and the lib dems Or do the hard core momentum supporters and the  liberal intelligencia just thing they weren't entitled to their view as with the referendum

Tue 17 Mar 2020, 21:30

Oh for Pete's sake, please remember some people who read this forum and are part of this lovely community still voted Conservative. It doesn't make us monsters and yet some of the posts here really make us feel unwelcome. Please stop vilifying us and a large proportion of this district that voted this way. We are still human. 

Tue 17 Mar 2020, 13:57 (last edited on Tue 17 Mar 2020, 13:59)

And West Oxfordshire residents only have themselves to blame for voting Robert Courts in yet again.It's where you place that cross that matters, regardless of the system.

Mon 16 Mar 2020, 18:30

Despite the title of the forum this thread really isn't so much a debate but an exchange of insults against perceived political enemies.

Mon 16 Mar 2020, 13:13

Just for the record ... I am an "ex-public schoolboy" ... and I can truthfully say that I have never voted Tory in my life. It is a record of which I am proud.
Liz ... maybe you could add a "Some" to the front of your post?! ;-) 

Sun 15 Mar 2020, 23:20 (last edited on Sun 15 Mar 2020, 23:33)

With the world falling down around our ears I guess this doesn't seem so important.  But in the hope that 'normal service will be resumed as soon as possible' (you have to be of a certain age to recognise that)....

I was thinking more widely than just the last election.  But of course agree totally with Liz re the electoral system.  And would be the first to acknowledge that the divisions, ineffectiveness, incompetence - and in one case, the equivocation - among the main (English) opposition parties played a large part in the Tories gaining such a large majority.  Much the same could be said of the 2016 referendum.

Then again (Tony) - just for some fun while avoiding Coronavirus - when is a Socialist not a Marxist - or vice-versa?? As we'll all be holed up for a while, essays please by the end of April - just don't send them to me!

PS Just in case, I didn't mean to imply that all ex-public schoolboys are smug Tories - many of my best friends etc etc....!

Thu 12 Mar 2020, 16:02

Smug public schoolboys and an electoral system that denies most voters the chance to have an effective vote.

Mon 9 Mar 2020, 22:44

I think it's quite clear why we are ruled by smug public schoolboys Labour are run by left wing Marxists supported by momementum run by a smug public schoolboy Jon Lansmen who according to a real socialist Alan Johnson couldn't lead the working class out of a paper bag The lib dems decided democracy didn't matter with their revoke policy The electorate soundly rejected both So the three reasons we've got Johnson as PM are Corbyn, McDonald and Swinson

Sat 7 Mar 2020, 12:25 (last edited on Sat 7 Mar 2020, 20:57)

Thank you Ali & Mathew for drawing our attention to this.

 It never ceases to amaze me how in 2020 we are still ruled by these smug ex-public schoolboys with their over-weaning sense of entitlement. 

 There’s a clue or 2 to how they maintain their grip in Guy Shrubsole’s excellent book ‘Who owns England?’.  But be warned, it may lead to raised blood pressure if not wailing and gnashing of teeth…

Sat 7 Mar 2020, 11:06

Seems to me that flying the union flag in that way is entirely appropriate right now.

Thu 5 Mar 2020, 22:20

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jacob-rees-mogg-union-jack-flag-tory-mp-robert-courts-coronavirus-a9378711.html

Thu 5 Mar 2020, 21:31

Thu 5 Mar 2020, 21:29

There's a debate section for this kind of comment. Also it would be useful if you were more specific rather than just snarky, but hopefully Richard will pop this in the new Grease Pit. 

Thu 5 Mar 2020, 18:23

Nice to see our MP will not flag in his efforts to address the most vexing issues of the day.