New Trains

Mon 22 May 2006, 21:36

Bump ! I am Milton based but a long time and regular user of what is currently the 9:38 Adelante service from Charlbury and can share my experiences. I have never yet had to make a reservation to use this train and so far (touching wood) not been refused entry because of all the spaces being taken up. There is room for 6 bikes, 3 at each end behind the drivers compartment. I usually wait at the rear end as this is where the conductor normally travels and is therefore the door most likely to open when the train arrives at station. The HST's also carry six but only in a single compartment usually at the front of the train (when leaving London), but not always, hence the point of uncertainty made earlier. One other thing to add, I have on occasion taken an earlier 'turbo' train from Shipton to Oxford and then onto a London train from there. This was fine until recently when the daft rule about not allowing bikes on trains into and out of London at rush hour (well four hours actually) was introduced. Anyway, hope some of this helps and happy cycling !

Sat 11 Mar 2006, 21:29

Can someone (Richard perhaps?) answer the following questions about carriage of bicycles on FGW trains?

1. My understanding is that you have to make a reservation each time you wish to take a bike on an Adelante train - is this true or not? My information on this may be out of date.

2. Is there a limit on the number of bikes that can be accommodated on an HST? (A long time ago I think it was two per powercar.) If there is a limit, what happens if it is exceeded? Does a mass punch-up take place on the platform and the weediest cyclist then has to cycle home instead?

Igor's point about not knowing in advance where the cycle-stowage area is going to be situated is a valid one - as we know, trains often run in reverse formation and therefore it is not possible to say for certain which end of the platform one should be standing. It's not much fun having to jostle your way to the other end of the station through a horde of irate commuters jabbing you in the ribs with their briefcases.

I only ever take my bike on Turbos as there is a "no questions asked" policy with regard to transporting bikes on these trains and you can put your bike in just about any vestibule you choose. However, I would consider also taking it on HSTs and Adelantes if I knew more about the procedure. Do FGW have an up-to-date leaflet on this subject?

Sat 11 Mar 2006, 15:29

Wouldn't it be nice if all class distinctions on trains were swept away and all passengers could enjoy the same high-quality "First Class" standard of accommodation? We pay enough for our tickets after all!

Sat 11 Mar 2006, 13:54

Refurbished HSTs:
First Class - Power points ..... positioned at every seat pair.
Standard Class - Power points provided at all table positions.
Failing to fit power points at all Standard Class airline style seats demonstrates FGW is out of touch with modern train traveller requirements (unlike Virgin with their Voyager trains).
It's a match for Great North Eastern Railways whose 2003 (not 1903!) menu card stated that First Class passengers were invited to dine in the restaurant car at any time while Standard Class passengers were allowed in if there were places available, provided they returned to Standard Accommodation when they had completed their meals.

Fri 10 Mar 2006, 16:11

Assuming that the HSTs are going to be worked the same way as now, and that the bike storage isn't disappearing in the refit, there should be plenty of space. It's in the end of carriage A, at the country (western) end of the platform.

I noticed the other day that Hanborough has gained stop-boards for HSTs, suggesting (a) that they've got permission to stop them there and (b) that they're planning to do so regularly!

Fri 10 Mar 2006, 10:10

Does Adrian or Richard know anything about cycle carriages on the new trains? I've given up taking my bike into Oxford on the train because I can never tell which end of the train the bike carriage is on, if in fact there is one at all. Coupled with the occasional berating I get from the train guards for not knowing in advance which end of the train the bike carriage is, it just isn't worth the hassle.

But if they're going to accomodate cyclists in a reasonable manner with proper information on the platform, I might consider it again.

Thu 9 Mar 2006, 21:12

Now that's what I call a summer holiday!

I think we know from the quality of information dispensed by the VDUs along the Cotswold Line that computers and FGW don't really go together and they are evidently just as inept when it comes to dealing with their emails.

Thu 9 Mar 2006, 16:56

I have had an acknowledgment to my email about the consultation on the new timetables as follows:
"I will be out of the office starting 08/03/2006 and will not return until 11/12/2006."
I am not sure whether this is the person who is meant to be considering our responses before the new timetable starts!

Wed 1 Mar 2006, 08:59

Now officially confirmed that the Adelantes will be leaving First Great Western in December. Reputedly not to Scotland, but "somewhere else in England".

Sun 19 Feb 2006, 21:00

Thanks for that, Adrian (presume you're in some way connected to FGW (; ). Interesting to hear that selective door opening is to be fitted.

Derek - the brakes always reminded me of the smell of BBC Micro computers at school, for some unearthly reason...

Thu 16 Feb 2006, 23:32

Looks promising from that online display. As near as one can judge from the display the seating does not look as cramped as some. I would be delighted to have the opportunity to be pleasantly surprised by FGW.

Thu 16 Feb 2006, 21:11

Okay, lets get the facts right. In 2005/06. FGW will receive £97m in subsidy from the Government, reducing to £46 million in 2006/07 and then £14million in 2008-09, after that they will pay money back to Government for the next seven years, totalling £1 billion.

It is likely that the Adelantes will be leaving FGW at the end of their lease, and they will be replaced by refurbished HSTs. FGW is spending £92 million on them, £40 million on new quieter and greener engines and £52 million on the interiors.

HSTs on the Costwold Line will be shortened by 1 coach to 7 coaches (by the removal of the buffet) to make them faster and will feature at-seat catering in response to customer feedback. There will have more airline seats (i.e. those without tables). The door system will be upgraded so they can stop at short platforms, like an Adelante.

They may be 30 years old but they are still the best long distance inter-city train in the UK - a new modern interior and more reliable engies will make them last another 10 years until HST2 is built. You can take a look at the new interior at www.firsthstshowcase.co.uk

Turbos will still be used on the last train from London/Oxford (as it forms the following morning 'halts' train), the morning and afternoon 'halts' trains, and the 19.51 from Charlbury (the return of the afternoon 'halts' train). Everything else will be 125mph (HSTs).

If only Network Rail could keep the track and signalling working at Ascott and Wolvercot...

Wed 15 Feb 2006, 23:15

I noticed on FGW's site the MD's letter on getting the new franchise states "The interiors of First Great Western’s High Speed Trains (HST) fleet will be totally redesigned providing a step change in passenger comfort and facilities together with increased capacity."

I have a feeling that the "step change" is going to be a step down if it is anything like the new rolling stock that Silverlink is using. Seats are closer together than on most airlines.

Wed 15 Feb 2006, 21:06

Shame about the withdrawal of the Adelantes. I was making a mental list the other day of all the good things I have noticed about FGW since they took over the running of the Cotswold Line. It looked like this:

1. Adelante trains
2. Er...
3. That's it.

So it's welcome back to HSTs. At least they no longer emit that horrible burning smell when the brakes are applied. It only took BR about 20 years to solve that problem!

Tue 14 Feb 2006, 11:42

Talking to one of the guards on the train recently he thought that FGW is planning to use shortened high speed trains, which would then deal with Hanborough, although I imagine they will carry fewer passengers.

The cynic in me wonders if the proposed 8.15, which replaces the 08.38, will still permit saver tickets as it is timed to leave Oxford well before 9.00am and the next London train will then be at 0953. I also see that the 16.18 from London will vanish, meaning the latest train we can get back with a cheap ticket will now be 15.22. I'm sure FGW woould never think this way!

Tue 14 Feb 2006, 00:10

FGW say they have not concluded the Adelante/HST issue yet, however, as both are 125MPH trains they could use either. As an aside, I have suggested they extend the 2252 in the December '06 timetable Paddington to Oxford, to Moreton in Marsh or beyond. Worth a try for nights out in london but, I suspect, the hours of the signal box at Moreton in Marsh may be the issue here.

Mon 13 Feb 2006, 20:17

Ref: Igor, So 'Adelante' (meaning 'Ahead' or 'Go Ahead') and 'Refresca' ('Refreshment' or 'Refreshing', so when the new old 125's come in, you could have:-
Rugged & Trusty = Rusty,
Shiny & Bright = .....
Ah when will FGW tell the truth?

Mon 13 Feb 2006, 19:19

FGW has just (quietly) published its proposed timetable for December. Full details at http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/franchise/en/Timetable.php .

Here's their summary - you can download a full PDF from their site. I've highlighted what look like the most significant changes.

• Clockface pattern of trains to/from London changed. Regular interval off-peak pattern. Some two hour gaps still remain (comparable with current service).
• All London trains call at Honeybourne and Pershore.
• All trains, except two morning and two evening peak HSTs, call at Hanborough.
• Except for one train each way (the ‘Oxfordshire Halts train’), all trains run through to/from London. Risk of missing connections at Oxford now reduced.
• All except two trains each way formed of 125mph stock.
• 1722 and 1822 Paddington to Hereford trains arrive some stations up to 10 minutes earlier.
• 0545 Hereford to Paddington arrives London 5 minutes earlier.
• 0652 Hereford to Paddington departs at 0630 and runs earlier throughout.
• 1618 Paddington to Great Malvern (‘Oxfordshire Halts train’) starts from Oxford at 1708, does not call at Honeybourne and terminates at Worcester Foregate Street.
• Although this document details changes on Mondays to Fridays, note that the DfT has specified no trains calling at Combe, Finstock and Ascott-under-Wychwood on Saturdays.

In other words; the only Turbos are the last train from London/Oxford, the Combe/Finstock stoppers, and the 19.51 from Charlbury. Everything else is (presumably) HSTs. The 08.40 to London becomes the 08.15, and the 17.22 from Oxford moves earlier still, becoming the 17.08.

Mon 13 Feb 2006, 17:56

Well, according to the minutes of a meeting held by one of the Worcester MPs (www.michaelfoster.co.uk/detail.asp?articleid=448), FGW ARE replacing the Adelantes with HSTs - and refurbished HSTs at that.
And according to the FGW website, the refurb means satellite-based WiFi and power connections even in cattle class.
So we'll have lots to do, however long we're stuck at Wolvercote.
Though even if true, I'd rather just not be stuck at Wolvercote.

Wed 8 Feb 2006, 12:30

If they really are replacing the Adelantes with "30-year old trains", we won't be too badly off - because that means High Speed Trains (Intercity 125s), and they're splendid, comfortable beasts.

But I'm more worried that they might reintroduce the ghastly Turbos (15 years old, I think), with their cramped five-across seating, barely functional aircon, and filthy toilets. HSTs would seem an odd choice for the Cotswold Line, especially because they're not permitted to stop at Hanborough.

Wed 8 Feb 2006, 08:53

It was reported on local television last night that FGW will replace all the Adelantes on the Cotswold line with 30 year trains from this summer in order to save money, even though they receive £100 million a year from the government.

I believe the abolition of the cheap day returns was intended to apply to trains leaving London before 4pm, and I expect the current 5pm limit will be put back to that sooner or later. However, the government is planning a bill to allow train companies to do away with all cheaper tickets, when presumably we'll have to pay the full £44 for a London return.

None of this was mentioned by FGW when the applied to renew their franchise. All we got were the usual lies about improving the rolling stock and service!

Fri 3 Feb 2006, 10:40

Could somebody please explain to me why FGW thinks that their customers are better serviced by adopting pigeon-Spanish marketing terms like 'Adelante' (meaning 'Ahead' or 'Go Ahead') and 'Refresca' ('Refreshment' or 'Refreshing')?

Is a stale, overpriced sandwich really improved when you call it something else in a foreign language?

Likewise, do trains run better if they adopt foreign names?

Wed 1 Feb 2006, 20:49

According to the recent "News" item on this web page, FGW are taking away the recently introduced 'Adelante' trains either in June or December. But I am sure there will be nothing to worry about, that may mean 2007, 8, 9, 10..... (thats the way the train arrivals board at the station goes anyway).

We might lucky enough to have Stephenson's 'Rocket', Puffing Billy, or the Mallard / Flying Scotsman at least THEY ran on time