Zebra Crossing on the Slade

Fri 23 Feb, 21:36

I heard today that the spec agreed for the zebra crossing has not been created. Beacons nearer road side, barriers either side plus a central reservation.  I think visibility is decreased by rain collecting in the uneven surface.

Fri 23 Feb, 18:50

There is no such thing as "right of way" in the Highway Code. This is a quote from the official UK Government site on the subject.

"The rules in The Highway Code do not give you the right of way in any circumstance, but they advise you when you should give way to others."
The reason for this is that people believing they have "right of way" seems to relieve them of the responsibility for their own safety and avoiding accidents. In the Highway Code it is the responsibility of everybody for their own safety first, and unwise to rely on others to always follow all those "should" rules.

What the Highway Code does is tell people under what circumstances they should give priority. Thus the new guidance about giving pedestrians priority when crossing side roads, at roundabouts and so on. Personally, I think some of those are potentially dangerous, especially on multi-lane exits on fairly fast roundabouts where stopping suddenly might not be wise, and on the exit, you may stop on one lane but who knows if a vehicle on the next one over will do so.

In any event, whatever you do, don't just step off the pavement thinking that you have the right to do so. Always, but always check it is safe first. The vehicles are meant to give way, but that does not mean you can assume right of way. 

Note that this does not mean responsibility is shared equally. Roughly speaking, those that can do the most damage are charged with the most responsibility. Thus the driver of an HGV has more responsibility than the driver of a car, and a care driver has more responsibility than a cyclist who, in turn, has more responsibility than a pedestrian.

Fri 23 Feb, 09:58

I thought pedestrians had right of way on roads now, followed by cyclists!! In which case if I was crossing the road by the top of Enstone Road and stepped into the road cars would have to wait!! I maybe wrong! 

Thu 22 Feb, 15:53

Unfortunately, there have been cases of drivers failing to stop even when the crossing patrol is on the crossing.  This suggests that a police visit one morning might be desirable (if an optimistic aspiration).

Thu 22 Feb, 12:57

If all drivers were doing 20 or less, fully away of the surroundings and courteous of pedestrians, and then all pedestrians were aware of the road users, then we wouldn't need a crossing in the first place!

Thu 22 Feb, 10:54

With regards to the new zebra crossing on the Slade, if drivers are observing the 20 speed limit and pedestrians are using self awareness for their safety then both parties should have plenty time to observe the other and take suitable steps to avoid issues? 

Wed 21 Feb, 22:31

In response to Mark's question.  I taught in a primary school in Buckinghamshire before moving here and we certainly did do road safety throughout a child's time in school.  In addition, Year 6 children were given extra training before moving up to secondary school which involved basic road safety.  In addition, a lorry was driven onto our playground so that the pupils could find out for themselves how restricted the view is from the driver's cab so that they understood the dangers out on the roads when travelling to and from school on their own. I'm sure most schools have a similar scheme of road safety training.  We also had cycling proficiency as do many schools around here.

Wed 21 Feb, 20:28

Firstly, i hope the person involved in this incident is getting better.  Secondly, from 1970 the Green Cross Code was introduced. STOP, LOOK and LISTEN.  For 53 years , road safety has been a topic and the continuation of road safety near schools and playgrounds needs to form part of a child’s education , Does this happen in schools these days. ? Poor road markings and the need to make hazardous pinch points, junctions and kerbs should be visible / painted and maintained. Road safety, like cycling proficiency, needs to be part of attending school - if not already.

Wed 21 Feb, 19:10

Let’s hope that ‘due course’ for the contractors to repaint the lines is very, very soon! 

Wed 21 Feb, 18:59 (last edited on Wed 21 Feb, 19:00)

There are signs. Highly visible - saw them today.  The crossing will be cleaned up in due course by the contractors.

Wed 21 Feb, 18:59

I feel there should at the very least be New Road Layout ‘ signs. Pauline our lovely lollipop lady has been situated at the new zebra crossing when I have driven past.  The white lines still look dirty even with all the rain.  I have seen many new zebra crossings put in over the years but this does no5 look new or easy to see when driving, other than the beacons.

Wed 21 Feb, 18:56 (last edited on Wed 21 Feb, 18:58)

Pauline, the lollipop lady, will use the zebra crossing from now on.  The school has told children that this is where they can cross now.

Wed 21 Feb, 17:49

I should add that I do think it is great that the crossing has been built, and I know the town council have helped to get that done - so thank you. If we can just make it a bit safer to use that would make it very beneficial.

Wed 21 Feb, 17:47

Thanks for that clarification on the highway code rules Steve.  One of my concerns with the crossing, as others have mentioned, is that it is quite wide. My children have to cross the road every day for the school bus, sometimes in the dark - and they wear dark school uniform. I'm worried that while traffic on their side of the road might stop for them, traffic on the other side might not even see them - so they then have to step out onto the crossing when the traffic is still moving on the other side, which feels risky.

I am not sure why Emily removed her posts but she mentioned that the town council had specified that the pavement be built out, both narrowing the space to cross and encouraging traffic to slow. I think that might be useful, but even better would be to put the central island back and split the crossing into two halves.

Finally, I think it would make much more sense for the lollypop lady to help primary school children at the zebra crossing - otherwise traffic is potentially going to have to stop twice, once for the lollypop lady, and once for the zebra crossing, which could be dangerous if they are not expecting that and caught by surprise at the second stop.

Wed 21 Feb, 13:27 (last edited on Wed 21 Feb, 13:37)

The Highway Code was changed in 2022 to say that drivers should give way to pedestrians waiting to cross a zebra crossing, but they must give way to one actually on the crossing. This was with a number of other changes. For example, drivers are now meant to give way…

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Wed 21 Feb, 11:01 (last edited on Wed 21 Feb, 11:04)

All of the comments have been noted, Claire, and I have been in touch with officers about this and responded to the various emails that I have received. And I hope that the young person who was involved in the accident is getting better - a shock for her, the bus driver and everyone on the bus, I imagine.

Wed 21 Feb, 10:24

It's really important that some of these comments are made to OCC directly, either via their website or by emailing our county councillors 

https://www.oxfordshire.gov.uk/residents/contact-council/contact-us

Although some town councillors read this forum, if you want your comments to be considered formally by the Town Council and responded to you need to write to the clerk: clerk@charlbury-tc.gov.uk

Wed 21 Feb, 10:22 (last edited on Wed 21 Feb, 10:24)

At least the new road layout signs are now in place, but going on the point from Frank that the traffic does not have to stop until someone has moved onto the crossing, then at times you could be taking your life into your own hands, your mind will be saying that the car will stop once I put a foot onto the crossing and the driver could be thinking well I'm fine to keep going as they have not started walking across yet, also why then is the Lolly Pop lady not taking the Children across the new crossing ? this morning she was in her usual spot ( doing a great job I grant you ) but would it not make sense for her to have an even better belt & braces safety net by using the Zebra Crossing  ?  

But then again I have wondered why didn't we just have a Pelican crossing installed in the first place as this would also help the partially sighted ?

Wed 21 Feb, 09:17

It’s worth bearing in mind Highway Code Rule 19:  “Remember that traffic does not have to stop until someone has moved onto the crossing” when explaining how to use these crossings.

Wed 21 Feb, 09:13

Agreed @gareth how do we get that sorted asap? 

Wed 21 Feb, 00:01

The obvious absence is of a warning sign that there is a pedestrian crossing ahead.  
It shouldn’t be seen as unreasonable for a highway authority to provide that sort of road signage.

(I shall keep other views to myself for now)

Tue 20 Feb, 22:52 (last edited on Wed 21 Feb, 00:49)

I drove back home at dusk this evening and was keen to seen the new crossing so was deliberately looking out for it. I'm sorry to say that although I could see the flashing lights, it wasn't obvious to me that they were linked to anything on the surface of the road and I couldn't see any road markings until I was nearly at the crossing - perhaps it has something to do with the curve of the road as you come up the hill and the ground is too flat to see the markings? And yet I knew the crossing was there and was actively looking for it. I believe it is actively dangerous as it is encouraging people (adults and children) to step into the path of vehicles that I feel sure won't be able to see the crossing and recognize what it is in time. It feels a lot less safe to me than the central reservation arrangement, which was very visible and also gave my 17-year-old special needs son a chance to regroup in the middle of the road before crossing again. The sloping, indefinite edge of the pavement that seems to go out into the road also gives him no clear boundary behind which to stand while waiting. I'm really sad about this, because he had mastered the previous arrangement and it worked for us (although it was still a bit 'heart-in-mouth'), but I certainly won't let him use this crossing on his own as it is, which now means he has no safe route from home to the Co-op, which is his favourite destination for practising his independence. :-( However, I want to add that I am grateful for the intention and hard work that must have gone into its creation. 

Tue 20 Feb, 22:02

Firstly, I really hope the child who was hurt is ok. Thank you to all who helped. Secondly, I do appreciate the effort here but agree that the circumstances around the accident need investigation and lessons should be learned and any liability understood. Finally how can we we ensure the crossing actually is used safely? Training, lighting, signs etc? Can the Town Council and OCC put their heads together please? Thank you!

Tue 20 Feb, 21:47

I still think keeping the central reservation would have been a bonus.

Tue 20 Feb, 21:37

Coming back tonight, driving up the  Slade to turn into  Crawborough, the crossing was difficult to see and with the headlights of oncoming traffic it would have been very difficult to spot anyone on the crossing. We were well under 20mph and the crossing still came up very quickly. Cars on the Slade regularly travel at well over the speed limit, many appearing to do 40mph or more and I’m really worried that at night in particular it is going to be extremely dangerous. 

Tue 20 Feb, 20:43

I used the new Zebra Crossing today for the first time with my wife and small granddaughter and I have to say it looks a real mess. The old road markings have been left behind from the previous central crossing island and these lines merge with the new crossing paintings and I think  present a confusion of road markings. I assume the previous road markings are now redundant and if so why did OCC not remove them before going 'live' with the new crossing. I did feel quite vulnerable standing waiting to cross as this will be new to drivers approaching and combined with no proper traffic lights in place and the failure of the 20mph speed limit through The Slade I think people crossing will need to be very vigilant whilst using this new crossing.  

Tue 20 Feb, 19:39

I think that Charlbury children will need to be instructed in the use of the zebra crossing. Many crossings now have the button to press and a lighted green or red walking man to indicate when safe to cross. I'm not sure that all children know that on a zebra crossing they must wait until traffic has stopped, of it's own volition, before the child should cross.

I too hope that the child involved in the accident is O.K.

Tue 20 Feb, 18:48

I commented on the appearance of the white stripes to the OCC team and they said it's because the surface is ridged and all the dirt from the works has collected in the ridges. 

Perhaps I'll take a broom on the school run tomorrow and see if I can brush it off!

Tue 20 Feb, 18:06

The zebra crossing does make crossing the Slade much easier. A big thank you to those involved.

Tue 20 Feb, 18:02

The zebra crossing is in a different position, several metres from the old crossing, so none of the paintwork should be faded as it is all completely new.

Tue 20 Feb, 17:22

I was surprised that the strips have not been repainted, the white stripes in the centre look very faded.

Tue 20 Feb, 17:13

At the time of the incident there was no closure of the road. 

Tue 20 Feb, 16:57 (last edited on Tue 20 Feb, 16:58)

I'm sorry to hear about this, and hope the child is OK. It is not, to put it mildly, an auspicious start and if the road was fully open without the zebra crossing beacons in operation, then that would surely be negligent.

I should add that I regret the loss of the central refuge with the new crossing.I'm also a bit surprised that the zebra crossing hasn't got a raised "hump".

Tue 20 Feb, 15:34

It still looks a bit unfinished. As a wheelchair user I am already appreciating the lower kerbs.

I happened to drive past probably only minutes after the accident happened yesterday and saw the child laying on the side of the road surrounded by people. I really really hope she's OK. Having seen exactly where it was, and the way the bus was angled in the road, it definitely looked like the zebra crossing could be a contributing factor. 

Tue 20 Feb, 14:35

Absolutely negligent to have left it in an un-functional state.

Tue 20 Feb, 12:57

OCC are on site now switching on the beacons and putting out extra signage so it will be fully operational before 3. 

Tue 20 Feb, 12:43

There is a van there now, 12:30 Tuesday,  seeming to put out signs and cones. 

Tue 20 Feb, 11:42 (last edited on Tue 20 Feb, 13:45)

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Tue 20 Feb, 11:38

Signs for traffic had better go up very quick, the kids getting off school buses this afternoon will assume it's a functional crossing!

Tue 20 Feb, 11:25 (last edited on Tue 20 Feb, 13:45)

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Tue 20 Feb, 11:17 (last edited on Tue 20 Feb, 11:20)

From what I saw last night, it was on the crossing. Really hope the child involved is okay. Swift action needs to be taken to make sure the new zebra crossing is safe.

Tue 20 Feb, 11:15 (last edited on Tue 20 Feb, 13:45)

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Tue 20 Feb, 11:13

I’ve just heard that someone was was knocked over on the crossing last night.

Tue 20 Feb, 10:20 (last edited on Tue 20 Feb, 13:44)

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Tue 20 Feb, 10:01 (last edited on Tue 20 Feb, 13:44)

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